H05006 HARDY, THE CARNIVALESQUE, AND RED- 1/24/05 - HARDY FORUM ARCHIVES ____________________________________________________________________________

From: jacky@wilkibob.me.uk

Subject: Hardy and red

Date: January 24, 2005 3:50:21 AM PST

I am commencing my final dissertation for my MA which concerns an assessment

of Hardy's use of the carnivalesque in 'Far From the Madding Crowd' and 'The

Mayor of Casterbridge', hopefully illustrating the increased darkness

surrounding his usage of it.

My immediate question concerns Hardy's use of the colour red throughout his

novels which I envisage as a carnivalesque colour as used by Hardy. I wonder

if you know of any books of criticism which may deal with this aspect of his

novels? I read in Millgate's new biography that Hardy could not, for example

stand a white letter or piece of paper against a red plush cloth,

suggesting he did have a strong interconnection with colour. Any pointers

you have would be most appreciated.

Jacky Wilkinson

jacky@wilkibob.me.uk

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From: schweikr@localnet.com

Subject: Re: Hardy and red

Date: January 24, 2005 6:20:32 AM PST

Dear Jacky,

Two works relevant to your inquiry that come immediately to my mind

are these:

J. Hillis Miller, Fiction and Repetition (Cambridge, MA: Harvard UP, 1982, pp. 122-4

Tony Tanner, "Colour and Movement in Hardy's Tess of the d'Urbervilles," in

Modern Critical Interpretations, ed. by Harold Bloom (New York, 1987), pp. 9-23.

There are, undoubtedly others.

All the best!

Bob Schweik

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From: wwmorgan@ilstu.edu

Subject: Re: Hardy and red

Date: January 24, 2005 6:54:17 AM PST

Hello, Jacky--

I can't think of critical works that approach either the color red or the concept of the carnivalesque in the two novels you mention, but here are two suggestions for more general approaches to the work you're doing:

(1) About the Carnivalesque in Hardy: G. Glen Wickens, Thomas Hardy, Monism, and the Carnival Tradition: The One and the Many in The Dynasts (Toronto: University of Toronto Press, 2002). [This book has received mixed reviews.]

(2) About the color red in Hardy: Martin Ray's Concordance to the Complete Poems shows more than 70 instances of RED and its variants appearing in Hardy's poems. You might try searching an electronic text of other Hardy works for instances of red.

Good luck with your work.

Bill Morgan

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From: hardycor@owl.csusm.edu

Subject: Re: Hardy and red

Date: January 24, 2005 7:16:13 AM PST

To: HARDY-L@csusm.edu

Reply-To: HARDY-L@csusm.edu

Jacky Wilkinson wrote:

My immediate question concerns Hardy's use of the colour red throughout his

novels which I envisage as a carnivalesque colour as used by Hardy. I wonder

if you know of any books of criticism which may deal with this aspect of his

novels?

Jacky, this is a long-shot, but one example of the use of this color was

influenced by Hardy's study of painters, according to F.B. Pinion, _A Hardy

Companion_ (196). "In an instant Bathsheba/s face coloured with the angry

crimson of a Danby sunset." FFMC xx. Danby was an Irish painter

(1795-1861).

 

Betty Cortus

hardycor@owl.csusm.edu

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From: jacky@wilkibob.me.uk

Subject: Re: Hardy and red

Date: January 24, 2005 7:23:37 AM PST

Thanks for that info, Bill. I have the copy of Wickens' book but in many ways it doesn't appear applicable to what I am doing. At the moment, referring to the colour red, I am, I think, beginning to make progress. The main interest area presently is Troy in his scarlet uniform in 'Far From the Madding Crowd' and I'm considering the idea of Troy representing the devil figure in carnival, the manipulator, and master of UNceremonies, as it were, the destructive, disruptive force in carnival. So that his 'red' does appear to have a very positive place in my search for the carnivalesque. I also find it fascinating in researching this area, that both Hardy and Bakhtin were involved in Rabelaisian study.

Jacky

jacky@wilkibob.me.uk

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From: ulin@exchange.upb.pitt.edu

Subject: Re: Hardy and red

Date: January 24, 2005 7:35:52 AM PST

I suppose if you are working on Hardy and colors, it would be worth looking at Donald Davie's "Hardy's Virgilian Purples" in Arion: A Journal of Humanities and the Classics, 1974; N.S. 1: 505-26. I think your project sounds more interesting than Davie's, which is more of an appreciation and a close reading (if I remember rightly from when I read it a long time ago), but it's a good piece and certainly relevant to any discussion of Hardy's use of color.

Don Ulin

University of Pittsburgh at Bradford

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From: Rosemarie.morgan@yale.edu

Subject: Re: Hardy and red

Date: January 24, 2005 9:13:28 AM PST

Jacky and I have had a brief (private) conversation about this "red" business but your mention of The Scarlet Man in FFMC has fired a few more synapses.

First off, I think perhaps there is nothing, in Hardy quite so sensitive to female bio-rhythms as his structuring of Tess's growth to womanhood, from the first (symbolic) blood effusion to the last, which is the drawing of Alec's blood -- Hardy calls this episode "fulfilment" (is Tess's "I am ready," at the second instance of the appropriation of her body intended to contrast with the unreadiness of the first?). The seriatim (rhythmic) nature of TD is well delineated. Hardy has "Phases" -- note, not "Parts", as in *Jude,* or "Volumes" as in *Woodlanders* --interestingly reminiscent of lunar rhythms. But enough of that!

In FFMC --- less purposefully artistic in structure -- the pattern isn't one of phasal blood-shedding but there is certainly a good deal of rising blood (blushing & flushing) from first to last. (I touched on this in *Cancelled Words* and W&S). Indeed there's one episode where-- after being embarrassed and shamed by Oak -- Bathsheba's "redness" is most intricately described; it's almost a "palette" in itself. This prompted me to think on the internal redness of the woman and the external redness of the man (Troy) -- and that he too, like Alec, ends by shedding his blood (Bathsheba being implicated albeit not as direct agent).

Of course this may be Rabelaisian only insofar as it may be MY imagination which is exuberant!

Cheers,

Rosemarie

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From: helengibson@clara.co.uk

Subject: RE: Hardy and red

Date: January 25, 2005 3:36:26 AM PST

On a more mundane level, the juxtaposition of some colours is thought to

be unlucky - i.e. that a bunch of red and white flowers should not be

brought to someone in hospital. The connotations there are obvious, but

I have also heard it said that 'blue and green should never be seen' -

but have no idea why!

I think the red and white superstition is widespread - I have heard it

here in Dorset and from a nurse in South Africa.

Best wishes,

Helen Gibson

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From: segr@segr-music.net

Subject: RE: Hardy and red

Date: January 25, 2005 6:09:13 AM PST

How odd, Helen (and others),when one remembers

the choice of colours for the Red Cross Organisation

and, don't forget, the flag of Saint George...,

or is this being too mundane?

Roy Buckle

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From: jacky@wilkibob.me.uk

Subject: Hardy and red

Date: January 25, 2005 7:36:04 AM PST

To: HARDY-L@csusm.edu

Reply-To: HARDY-L@csusm.edu

Further to the topic, I notice that Breughel in his carnivalesque paintings makes red predominant, and I was wondering if Hardy would be acquainted with the works of Breughal . He constantly refers to paintings and Millgate states that he spent quite a lot of time in art galleries in London. I wonder if he saw Breughal's work on his journeyings in Europe? The theme of red and black, the devil and death, seem to me to associate themselves with the character of Troy, and I was most interested in the comment on the internal red of women and the external red of the soldiers.

By the way, Helen, I think the saying you were looking for is: 'red and green are sweldom seen except upon an Irish queen'.

Jacky

jacky@wilkibob.me.uk

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From: Charles.Anesi@wellsfargo.com

Subject: RE: Hardy and red

Date: January 25, 2005 8:02:09 AM PST

This discussion reminds me of John Constable's sometimes weird use of red in

English country settings. This may have resulted from Constable's (generally

agreed upon) deficient color vision. Wonder if Hardy had similar issues.

If so, we should not assume that when Hardy says "red" he means what most

people mean when they say "red".

 

Chuck Anesi

charles.anesi@wellsfargo.com

office 480-575-3478

cell 612-940-3345

fax 480-575-3519

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From: helengibson@clara.co.uk

Subject: RE: Hardy and red

Date: January 25, 2005 8:12:09 AM PST

Thank you, Jacky, that is a new one to me - and I shall remember it.

On the subject of paintings seen by Hardy when he was in London, I have long thought this was a most interesting subject. There must be records at the Royal Academy and other galleries of the artists who exhibited during those years.

Best wishes,

Helen

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From: Rosemarie.morgan@yale.edu

Subject: RE: Hardy and red

Date: January 25, 2005 8:24:24 AM PST

 

The language of flowers is entirely esoteric -- you know, red roses for love (blood-passion) and white lilies for sympathy (deathbeds)-: perhaps the combination of red and white flowers means something unfortunate -- er -- like "Love You But Please Die Soon."

Rosemarie

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From: Rosemarie.morgan@yale.edu

Subject: RE: Hardy and red

Date: January 25, 2005 9:09:55 AM PST

Just for a lark, here are some "red" snippets from TH's letters . There are dozens of Red Cross refs of course.

________________

About 6 months ago I left a copy of Hudibras, bound in bright red cloth, with Mr Aitchison, as a pattern for the binding of the Trumpet Major

______________

I send the "Desire" sketch, with the trifling modification. I think the insertion in red at the end improves it.

[Note: "Desire" became Spectre of the Real]

_________________________

I must really thank you for your warm letter, & for being so good as to read The Dynasts right through. I regret, of course, that I could not keep the whole thing by me for a time, so as to rewrite the more hasty lines & pages that you will have noticed. But, Eheu, Posthume! -- flying years compelled me to send out the whole red hot.

___________________________

But still it goes on: which is the biggest writer, Scott or Byron, Browning or Tennyson: even Darwin or Dickens. It is just like asking which is the best colour, red or blue.

____________________________

I thought I would not write till I had finished "Mahatma & the Hare" that you were so kind as to send me, & I have now just done so. It is a strangely attractive book -- to me at least -- although so simple. I am, as you may know, entirely on the side of the hare, & hope the Red Man may be one in his next incarnation.

_____________________

But the printers, or editor, omitted the date, as they always do, I suppose to give an apparently red-hot instancy to the writing.

_______________________

Just fancy your knowing S. when his hair was still red. I had no idea that you remembered him then.

___________________

For if you want your book to sell it is fatal to begin with any original vein you may be blest with -- to hear "some new thing", which so fascinated the Athenians, being a red rag to the English reviewer.

________________________

My advocacy would be a red rag to the Committee, & would endanger your cause, possibly ruin it, as I am excommunicated by the Council --

____________________

I have heard of a Green Dragon; (there is one a mile from here) -- I have heard of a Red Lion -- (one 5 miles off) & of a Black Bear (8 miles away) but I have never before met with a White Monkey

___________________________

Thinking over the question of printing the head-lines in red or black, I am personally in favour of black after all

[Millgate's Note: The Dynasts in red had evidently been discussed during the 19 June visit to Max Gate mentioned in Macmillan's letter; his letter of 25 June 26 (Macmillan letterbooks, BL) deferred a final decision, and red was in fact used for the shoulder headlines (showing act and scene numbers), and for some other elements of the vols. as published.]

_______________

On Mary Harrison: (Millgate's Note) TH called on her in early April, following her invitation of 2 Apr 92 (DCM), and found 'A striking woman: full, slightly voluptuous mouth, red lips, black hair and eyes: and most likeable'; see The Life and Work of Thomas Hardy, ed. Michael Millgate (London, 1984)

_______________________

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From: hardycor@owl.csusm.edu

Subject: Re: Hardy and red

Date: January 25, 2005 1:16:07 PM PST

Jacky Wrote:

Further to the topic, I notice that Breughel in his carnivalesque

paintings makes red predominant, and I was wondering if Hardy would be

acquainted with the works of Breughal .

Hardy doesn't mention Breughel in the "Schools of Painting Notebook,"

although he lists a number of other Flemish and Dutch Old Masters (_The

Personal Notebooks of Thomas Hardy_, Ed. Richard H. Taylor, 1979).

However, I think you have really started something Jacky, because I keep

seeing red all over the place now in Hardy. Here is another one:

"The handsome marchioness in geranium-red and diamonds, who was visible to

him on his host's right hand opposite, became one of the glowing vermilion

sunsets that he had watched so many times over Deadman's Bay . . . ." _The

Well-Beloved_, II. - iii.

All the Best,

Betty Cortus

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From: patrick@prassociates.co.uk

Subject: RE: Hardy and red

Date: January 26, 2005 4:36:45 AM PST

In the context of Hardy and red, I remember (I think) that some time back we

discussed TH's apparent interest in the word 'Troy'. In addition to Sgt.

Troy, it occurs in A Pair of Blue Eyes with reference to Stephen Smith: "'I

could live here always!' he said, and with such a tone and look of

unconscious revelation that Elfride was startled to find that her harmonies

had fired a small Troy, in the shape of Stephen's heart."

This, presumably means, that she had set his heart on fire but the

conflagration in Troy was also the city's destruction as, perhaps, love for

Elfride was Stephen's.

In the same novel there is the character of Charlotte Troyton who later

marries Elfride's father and becomes Mrs Swancourt.

In Far From the Madding Crowd, as well as Sergeant Troy, an important

episode takes place at the Buck's Head Inn in Roy-town, Hardy's name for the

hamlet of Troy Town between Puddletown (Weatherbury) and Dorchester

(Casterbridge), though this latter may have little to do with the current

discussion.

From his classical studies Hardy would have been well-aware of the

destruction of Troy by fire and I wonder if his use of red sometimes

signifies a kind of destructive conflagration. He certainly seems to have

been fascinated by fire.

I don't think anyone has mentioned the reddleman in Return of the Native yet

....

Patrick Roper

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From: jacky@wilkibob.me.uk

Subject: RE: Hardy and red

Date: January 26, 2005 5:40:54 AM PST

That's fascinating about Troy, Patrick, and most useful to my argument. Of

course, the reddleman is ,apart from Troy, perhaps Hardy's most notable

figure, certainly in terms of the carnivalesque and grotesque. The problem

with organising my diss so far has not been a dearth of material but a

super-abundance of it.

My original intention was to look at the carnivalesque etc. across the

whole range of Hardy's most well known novels, but I soon realised that this

would fill at least a whole book, so then I decided to limit it to Far From

the madding Crowd and The Mayor of Casterbridge for various reasons. in the

event there is so much within the pages of FFTMC that I decided to

concentrate only that and perhaps save the rest for a PhD!

The 'red' idea 'flared up' in my brain one night and has taken off as a

conflagration', but I am still using it under the carnivalesque umbrella.

The discussions on the forum are proving most 'enlightening', and I am most

grateful to Rosemarie for pointing me in this direction.

Jacky

jacky@wilkibob.me.uk

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